Shane Rockpit interviews SPiT LiKE THiS leader Lord Zion
SPiT LiKE THiS lead singer Lord Zion is a veritable poster boy for rock n’ roll positivity, fitness and living your dreams. Self-proclaimed “Godfather of the SPiT LiKE THiS universe”, he created the band with bassist and long-term partner Vikki Spit. Together they built an offensive t-shirt business called www.smellyourmum.com from the ground up, originally to finance their rock dalliances, and now find it almost a full time job in itself.
The SPiT LiKE THiS story is already the stuff of legend, surely destined to be a great book or movie some day (Hint, Zion!), featuring great music, lineup changes, industry ripoffs, a powerful love story, the underdogs triumphing against a myriad of odds, an abundance of sex, drugs and heavy metal – and it’s barely started yet!
SPiT LiKE THiS head into the studio soon with legendary producer and Grammy nominee Chris Tsangarides to record their second album. The name of the album will be announced soon, along with a blog website of the same name which will document every stage of the album’s journey, from recording to release.
A complex, intelligent and witty individual, Zion calls a spade a spade and isn’t afraid to be opinionated and offensive in these increasingly bland times, but never does so gratuitously – there’s always a lot of thought gone into even the most seemingly throwaway comments you may see on his Facebook or Twitter pages, or in conversation.
Vikki and Zion put their heart and soul into SPiT LiKE THiS and Smell Your Mum, and indeed into everything they do. Zion is also a fantastic interviewee – and an admitted “media whore” - and I present our conversation in its entirety, almost verbatim.
To get close to the heart of someone who burns so brightly means to face your own truths along the journey. Buckle up and enjoy the ride…
Hi Zion – it’s been a pleasure getting to know you through your website, your music, and chatting on Facebook. Now I – on behalf of our readers on The Rockpit – would like to delve a little deeper into what makes you who you are…
Thanks Shane and right back at ya!
Let’s start with your name: Lord Zion. Zion itself is quite unique, and you’ve mentioned in the past that it’s not a stage name but your actual birth name – where did the “Lord” come from?
I had hippy parents who decided to experiment on me by giving me an outrageous name. You know that “what doesn’t kill us makes us stronger” maxim? I think they were testing that out. The Lordship happened for two reasons: first off, a bank very foolishly gave me a Platinum credit card and I needed to find something outrageous to do with it. The main reason though was because, only having one name and it being my first name, it annoyed the hell out of me when people called me Mr Zion. It would be like them calling you Mr Shane. It aggravated me. So I figured that, if they were going to insist on giving me a title, it was going to be one of my choosing, hence the Lordship.
It’s backfired slightly though as now they think that Lord is my first name and Zion is my second name, so the buggers STILL call me Mr Zion! On my passport, it just has Zion, so there is no confusion there (although I do have a special note in the back of mine which is the equivalent of “just humour him”).
There is probably a third reason which would be a bit too geeky and Star Wars-y to mention this early into the interview *ahem*
You’ve stated previously that having a “stupid name” [your words] at school attracted all the wrong sort of attention and got you bullied mercilessly before you realized how unique you actually were. As you know, my girlfriend Trulie suffered from the same thing and as a child hated her name and wished she was Julie or Karen or anything “normal”. How important was this feeling of uniqueness and the relentless bullying in terms of making you who you are today?
Until I went to school aged 5, I didn’t think too much or too often about myself. I was just a kid who did kid things and minded my own business. Then I went to school and found out I had the triple whammy: I was fat, had a stupid name and looked like a girl! So, the taunts and merciless bullying started and, for many years, I just wanted to crawl into the corner and hide. I’ve never been a violent person and I didn’t know how to cope with the situation. My mum had recently divorced so I was feeling pretty lonely for many years. It used to really hurt when so-called friends would turn on me, to save their own face.
And that was pretty much my school days until I hit about 15. I’d recently discovered hard rock / metal and my school held a “pop mime”. I saw my hand shoot up to volunteer for it and, next thing I know, I am miming Def Leppard and Guns N’ Roses songs to over 1,000 kids and getting huge applause. They particularly liked my over-zealous use of the “wanker” sign at all the teachers and when I came out with a can of beer and sprayed it over the front row.
Overnight, I had found my inner Rock God and, all of a sudden, I wasn’t the fat kid with a stupid name and a girlie face to bully every day, I was this weird kid with balls of steel that just told all the teachers essentially to fuck off and got the beer out in front of them. My kudos went through the roof and I remained something to be misunderstood and slightly fearful of until those school days were over.
I wouldn’t wish bullying on anyone. All bullying stems from fear (ie a fear of the unknown, the unusual, being unpopular) and it is truly cowardly. The few friends I had through school were bullied themselves and we have all grown up to be very different people. Although I wouldn’t want to repeat the experience, I’m glad that I went through it as it totally, 100%, made me into the man I am today. Once I found those balls of steel, they never left and, these days, absolutely no-one fucks with me or gets the better of me. It has made me fearless.
Very strangely, all 4 of us in SLT were victims of bullying in school, all for different reasons. It’s great that we have found each other and now stand united as an example of what the bullied kid can grow up to be. I’m quite proud of that.
You don’t come across as the shy retiring type at all – apart from the obvious (you’re a talented muso, my female friends advise me that you’re pretty hot, you have a gorgeous girlfriend, etc etc), what fuels your self confidence and self belief?
I’m quite a typical Gemini and have two VERY different sides to my personality. On one side, I am pretty quiet, like to keep myself to myself and am pretty unsociable. But, get me on a stage and this whole different beast emerges! I wish I could bottle that feeling to sell it as it is totally unreal. I’ve always attracted attention – unwanted or otherwise – and there is nothing I can do about it. Even when I am trying to be as incognito as possible, I still seem to be the object that gets noticed so there is no point fighting that. It is a Do or Die situation, Fight Or Flight. It would be untrue to myself if I didn’t unleash the beast often and I’d end up being a serial killer or dictator instead. So, for the good of mankind, I channel my energies toward music. It’s either that or genocide (laughs)
You and Vikki (Spit, bassist) are the core of SPiT LiKE THiS as well as being a dedicated couple, and co-run your “offensive n’ fun” t-shirt company Smell your mum. Do you never feel like a break from each other?
I can’t speak for Vikki but, throughout my life, I have always had a best friend who happened to be female. Vikki has been my best friend now for 10 years (and not in a soppy wet bell-end way) and I enjoy just hanging out with her. I think the key to a successful personal relationship IS friendship. Without that it is doomed to fail. Plus we are both very honest people. We don’t have to “work” on our relationship, it just is. We seem to understand each other, we have been through a lot together and have achieved a lot together.
We often have one of those moments when we recall the very early days of all this nonsense, when our landlord told us he was evicting us - we had zero money and no idea what to do next. We’re both fighters though, both very intelligent and, day-by-day, edged our way forward to where we are now. And even now, on a daily basis, we work as a team extremely hard to achieve our dreams. Nothing we have got has come easy, it’s been an endless swim against the tide but, what else are we gonna do??! We’ve come this far so there’s no stopping us now!
Being in the public eye is a burden as well as a gift. Has the attention ever threatened your relationship? Both you and Vikki are extremely attractive people – you’ve even been voted a Rock Devil by the 50,000 members of the Rock Chicks Rule Myspace site, and no doubt Vikki has had her share of unwanted attention from the sleaze mongers?
That’s an interesting question but the short answer is No. We don’t take ourselves seriously (although we take what we do VERY seriously) so, whilst being voted a Rock Devil is very flattering, it doesn’t mean that much in the big picture. I’m sure you could find 50,000 women who would vote me a Rock Gargoyle just as quickly! Vikki does get a lot of attention and even the odd proposal of marriage but, I’m not a jealous person so it doesn’t wind me up. But then I know that Vikki wouldn’t be leading anyone on as she’s not that kind of gal. However well known we get, I can’t see the attention ever getting in the way because, first and foremost, we’re a team.
There’s something incredibly powerful and sexual about a girl with a guitar, and Vikki is as talented as they come. Does having a girl in the band open more doors than it closes?
If I’m being brutally honest, I think it probably closes more doors than it opens. For every one person who thinks it’s awesome having a girl in the band, there are two that think girls can’t play. Rock/Metal is a very male arena and some do think there is no place in it for a girl (unless they are dancing sexily on the stage) so, without hearing a note, a lot of people will dismiss us. It does tend to be the older generation that think that, the kids are always pretty cool with it and Vikki is an idol to a lot of young girls.
I love Vikki’s quote “You don’t need a cock to rock”, but are there still people out there so narrow minded they think chicks can’t – or shouldn’t – rock?
Totally – see above! And I have to be honest, when I was a kid growing up, I probably felt the same. I learnt the error of my ways though! Vikki is Nikki Sixx with tits, it’s that simple. Not in the drugs & booze way, but in the intense rocking stage performance. Anyone that doesn’t believe me should come and check her out live! Vikki often bemoans other girl musicians though who “don’t do her sex any favours” by getting on the stage and NOT rocking out as hard as possible. Vikki isn’t in the band because she looks good or because she’s my partner, she’s in because she is absolutely the best person out there to play bass in SLT. Simple as.
Smell Your Mum came about as you needed to raise funds to record your second EP “Anarchy for two” and has since taken off of it’s own accord. Have you ever considered abandoning the rock career for a career as t-shirt moguls?
Never for a second! I think that, if we had set out to try and deliberately create what we have accidentally created, it would have failed. We have seen many similar sites come and go. The reason we are still around is because we have a story. Every t-shirt is designed by us and hand printed by Vikki and, every penny we earn, goes into SLT. People like that, they like to know that they are buying from a couple of obnoxious idiots rather than a corporation set on exploiting a movement. If we didn’t have the band to run, we’d be pretty well-off – we’ve sold a lot of T-shirts – but we are also very much looking forward to the day where it doesn’t take up as much time as it does. We do the tees to fund and promote the band – that is the ultimate goal so, as soon as we don’t have to do the day-to-day on it, we won’t! Having said that though, I am really proud of the site, the way we run it and what we produce. When the day comes, we will make sure the day-to-day running is done by someone just like us and we will always oversee the whole thing, to make sure it doesn’t lose it’s ethos. (ie to offend as many people as we can!!)
Vikki prints your shirts herself the old fashioned way, taking over your kitchen table for the job! Can you briefly describe the process for those who don’t understand screen printing?
I’m a bit fuzzy on the details, but it generally goes like this: one of us, usually me, will come up with an outrageous, offensive or just plain funny idea for a T-shirt. It gets Googled to make sure it’s unique then I set about designing the way it looks. That design gets printed onto an acetate which then gets exposed onto a screen (which is a frame with mesh stretched across it), similar to the way photos used to get exposed. Once the screen is made, it gets laid on the T-shirt, ink put on it and then squeegied across it. The ink goes through the design on the screen and is left on the tee where it is then dryed by something resembling a large element. The actual printing process takes about 5-10 minutes per T-shirt, so Vikki can print a lot in her day. Unfortunately, this has lead to her having really bad RSI in her thumb, something she has to ice twice a day for 10 minutes a time. Not nice! It’s this sort of thing that pisses me off when people think that Vikki is just the “token bird” on stage there just to look pretty. Those people can fuck right off – she works like a slave for SLT.
You have a new guitarist on board, just in time for the recording of your second album – how did you hook up with Rob Riot?
I’ve actually known Rob for years – more years than I care to remember! One of my very first bands was with him and, together, we wrote “Sex, Drugs & Heavy Metal” which ended up as the opening track on our current album. I had always admired his rhythm playing as it was incredibly tight, plus his ability to write the coolest riffs on the block. Rob used to have a bad drink problem which, ultimately, lead to that band falling apart and us falling out. Rob went back to Canada and I went off on my own rock n’ roll journey.
Fast forward some years and Rob rang me out of the blue a few weeks back. He’d seen and bought our album from HMV, found my number online and rang basically to say congratulations. We got talking and it was just like old times – lots and LOTS of laughter – something I had missed recently. This coincided rather conveniently with increasing tension between us and our old guitar player. We wanted different things out of this adventure than he did so it was decided that he should leave.
Immediately, I gave Rob a call and asked if he might be interested in coming down for an audition. The drink problem had been resolved years before so, without that in the way, I knew what fun we could have. Vikki and Gilez were keen to meet him as they’d heard my stories about the mischief we used to make!
Rather fortuitously, I had recorded what was to be our last rehearsal with our old guitar player, so I sent that tape up to Rob to learn some tracks. He came down a week later and, I gotta admit, the first rehearsal was a bit of a disaster. I felt like a fool and had pretty much worked out what excuse I was going to give him for the audition not working out. He hung around the house for a few days though and, at least I thought, it was great to have an old friend back in my life.
I wandered into the second rehearsal with a “let’s just get this out of the way” kind of attitude toward it. Rob plugged in, we started playing and WOAH! WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON??!!! It was crazy good! We later found out that he was really nervous at the first rehearsal and I guess that, spending a few days with us chilled him out and all the good shit rose to the surface. No disrespect to anyone else we have worked with but, after just two rehearsals, we have never been so tight. He’s breathed new life into old works and is making the new songs his own. I am VERY excited by his recruitment (we offered him the job that night) and cannot wait for rehearsal tomorrow!
The album is to be recorded with legendary Grammy nominated producer Chris Tsangarides. How did you and The Dark Lord hook up?
I’ve been aware of CT for years, having purchased both “Painkiller” by Judas Priest and “Berzerk” by Tigertailz back in 1990. Both records blew me away. He came back on my radar though when I saw the Anvil movie – he seemed like a really nice guy so I decided to chance my arm. We’d just played with Tigertailz so I mentioned that when I contacted him and said that I’d love to talk with him about album 2. He famously states that he only produces bands that he likes so I fully expected him to tell us where to go, but he didn’t!
A few messages flew back and forth then we went to see him back in March at his Ecology studios. He was just as I hoped he would be – funny! – and we organised the start date (July 5th) shortly thereafter. I am REALLY looking forward to recording this album with him, as much for the experience as the end result.
How important is a good producer to the finished sound of an album?
One thing we have suffered from, as a band, is a lack of strong musical identity. When SLT first started, I wrote everything and recorded the stuff in a home studio situation. The early material is very eclectic and quite processed in it’s sound. It was very well received, played on the radio where one DJ told me I’d invented the “Goth Glam” sound. We were even offered a 5 album deal by Douglas Mew, the guy behind such bands as Lindasfarne and Genesis!
But, I really wanted a “proper” band, so put one together. This totally changed our sound though as it became much less processed, much more organic. This meant that some songs that worked REALLY well on my recordings just didn’t work live (“Trust Your Instincts” being the biggest culprit!).
When we came around to recording our debut album, we really wanted to put together a CD of all the best songs I had written / co-written over my musical journey so far. The result is eclectic and, as a result, was very hard to make sound cohesive. Personally, I think we have succeeded if you listen to the album as a whole, as I spent a LONG time working on the album track listing arrangement. The album’s mood shifts from light, to dark to quirky and, in that context, works. However, if you listened to “Sex, Drugs & Heavy Metal” next to “Hunt You Down”, you wouldn’t believe it was the same band. I get that, but my favourite albums were things like “Sheer Heart Attack” by Queen and they went all over the place!
The producer for our debut, Paul Tipler, did have a hard time with us. How do you record a band doing a full-on rock number next to an almost 100% synthesized number? With great difficulty, that’s how! I think Paul did a great job and I am really proud of what we created together.
Album 2 though comes with a clean slate. All but one song is brand new, written solely for this album and they have mostly been written by the band. As a result, they are more cohesive. It is going to be Chris’s job to determine EXACTLY what the SPiT LiKE THiS sound is so that, when we are asked, we can actually tell people!!
Chris’s discography is amazing as well as diverse. What was it about his sound and style which drew you to working with him?
For me, the diversity is a bonus. I listen to all sorts of music, from the heaviest metal has to offer, through the 80’s glam stuff, onto 70’s prog rock and then into some rap, hip-hop, R&B, pop and beyond. To me, it is the song that stands out, not the style. It will be a gift to work with someone whose sole purpose is to make the best out of a song; I know he won’t limit what we can be. And, sonically, I wanted this CD to be harder and heavier, to better reflect what we are live. I know Chris will capture that – it’s something he’s famous for!
You’ve released 4 EPs, as well as a compilation of them (“Scary Tales”), yet you’ve mentioned you never got paid for that release, and are in the process of regaining the rights to those songs. What went wrong, and what would your advice be to young bands about retaining ownership of their music?
There are a lot of sharks and thieves out there that feed off of young, hungry, naiive bands. We have encountered them all. Luckily, we have ridded ourselves of them all as well, so the next album can be released with a 100% clean slate (a gift for our label, I can tell you!). The thing is, as much as I hate them, I think a young band almost needs them for the leg-up they provide. Yes, they cause you trouble. Yes, they steal from you but, without them, you might still be on the bottom rung of the ladder. Every bad deal we have ever signed has risen us up the greasy pole of the music business. So, I accept it as part of the business. I would say to any young band, if you are happy to sign a deal, go for it and just take as much as you can from it. If it is a bad deal, it won’t stand up in court so, once you have gotten where you want, you can sue to get stuff back. That’s what I’m doing and it’s working. I’m an honest person and conduct myself personally and professionally in that manner – as long as you are the same, you will always have that moral higher ground so, whilst you may not win every battle, you will ALWAYS win the war!
Vile Gilez has been with you pounding the skins since your early days. Can you tell us a few things about him?
Sure. Number 1, he is truly mad. I have met some unhinged individuals in my time, but he wins the prize as number one nutjob. The things he mentions in passing are the things that you don’t expect normal people to be involved in. Armed robbery, arson, drugs, prostitutes..they are all things that were once part of the Vile Gilez arsenal. And he saw no wrong in any of it. Thankfully, for us all, his mental state has changed to one of only a semi-psychopath so he is much more congenial than he once was. He’s been the backbone of SLT since 2003 and I cannot ever see that changing (unless he goes back to the robbery, arson etc!!). All drummers have to be mad to be good. It’s my theory that, when they learn independence of their limbs, it does something weird to their brains. And I’m not kidding!
2007 was a big year for the band, recording your debut album and scoring a slot on the bill of Hard Rock Hell (the only unsigned act to appear on the main stages). Did it feel at the time that all your hard work was starting to pay off and things were finally falling into place?
To an extent, yes. But then, as we have had to work hard for everything, you almost don’t notice it when it happens, it just seems like another gig. It’s only in hindsight that you realise what has been achieved. Being in SLT is truly one of those “journey of a thousand miles starts with a single step” journeys, this makes the gradual increase we make virtually imperceptible to ourselves! Also, regarding Hard Rock Hell, we had no idea how important that was going to be in our lives and careers. We really have an awful lot to thank them for. We’ve done 3 HRH’s now and have the Road Trip coming up – without their support, I’m not sure where we’d be. We don’t take anything for granted.
It was almost a year from recording til the release of “We won’t hurt you (But we won’t go away)” – that must’ve felt disheartening after being so pumped up?
It was actually just over a year, I think. We finished it Sept 2008 and it first came out in the UK Nov 2009. It would have been nice to have gotten it out quicker but, hey, we got it out! Just having an album sitting on the shelves of a record store means that we have achieved more than 99.9% of all other bands ever formed achieve. That’ll do me!!
Is patience a necessary strength to possess in the rock n’ roll industry?
Absolutely! In many respects, I am extremely impatient. I want everything right now. But then, I have been working in the music business since I was 18 and it’s only now that it really looks like things are coming to fruition, so I am either extremely patient, tenacious or a sucker for punishment! Compared to any other industry, I’ve been in the mail room for ever and I’ve only just been promoted to tea boy! If you are thinking about starting a band and are giving yourself a deadline to “make it”, forget it. You have to be a rock n’ roll lifer to give yourself even the smallest chance of success.
Late in 2009 the album was re-released with your infamous cover of the Rocky Horror Picture Show classic ‘Sweet Transvestite’. It was here that you really started to get the attention you deserve. How important, in terms of publicity, did you find recording a cover of a much-loved song was?
Well, considering half the reviews we get hate that song and half love it, not important! We never started playing it for attention, we played it for our own amusement. It really does divide everyone, both live and on CD. I am sure we could capitalise on it much more than we have, but we don’t want to be known as “that Rocky Horror band”. The next album won’t have any RHPS covers on, so please don’t anyone expect us to be doing the “Timewarp” any time soon! Having said that, I think our version surpasses the original.
You have close ties with Hard Rock Hell, being the only band to appear at all three festivals, and you’re to be there again this year. How does your uber-camp glammed up punky metal go down with the hardcore headbangers?
Not sure if we will be at HRH4, although the campers are asking for us again! We are doing the Road Trip though. Our set goes down really well with 99% of the people there. HRH is a very fun weekend so we go down a treat. SLT loves HRH!
Being very confident and not afraid to camp it up a bit, have you run into any trouble with the meatheads in any audience who may feel their sexuality threatened by your antics?
On the whole, they are OK with it. I don’t think it would work if I camped it up through the whole set, or if I were a shrinking violet. Fact of the matter is, on stage, I am pretty intense and have been told, pretty scary. Only a small portion of the set has that element and, if people don’t like it, they can use that part to go and get a drink or something. Most people know I’m fucking the bass player so they somehow figure it must be OK for me to behave like that now and then!!
What do you expect from Germany’s Wacken festival?
Nothing, other than the chance to show a new country what SLT is all about. We are honoured to be given such a huge opportunity. Obviously, HRH has been huge for us so we hope that Wacken will open doors, but we certainly don’t expect it. Just playing it is enough, anything else will just be gravy!
Sex + Subversion x Style = SPiT LiKE THiS. Please explain!
That’s the little equation that makes up SLT. I always remember on the Frankie Goes To Hollywood “Welcome To The Pleasuredome” album they had this cool equation, something like “The Power x The Bomb + The Love = Frankie” and I just thought that was awesome. Not sure what FGTH were like in any other country but, in the UK, they were huge and they made a massive impact on me musically and from a marketing perspective. I got totally drawn into it all and, in hindsight, saw why (apart from the great songs) I was so addicted. One day, I was thinking what the SLT equivalent equation would be and came up with that!
Where can fans find out more about SPiT LiKE THiS and buy merch and music from?
I would direct everyone to our main www.spitlikethis.com site and explore that. From there, you can view videos, listen to MP3’s and, should the fancy take you, buy our album. Also check out www.smellyourmum.com - free shipping to Australia!
‘Sex, Drugs and Heavy Metal’ – apart from being a great song and an attention grabber, is this still a personal manifesto? You’ve told me before that you’ve replaced drugs with Maltesers more recently (Trulie promised we’d talk about Maltesers!!)!
Ha! Glad to get the Maltesers in!! It’s no longer a manifesto, and I did consider replacing “drugs” with “drums” but then I thought about what the song was actually about – which is freedom and individuality. So, even though drugs no longer make up part of my constitution, I still believe in the freedom to take them, if that’s what you want to do.
I’m not sure what makes Trulie dig you guys more – the great music, your positive outlook, or the Malteser fetish! Do you feel like icons – musically, stylistically, or as spokespeople for a generation?
I think that spokespeople for a generation is pushing it, but we have had kind messages from bands that say they look to us for inspiration. When we started, in the UK, no-one was doing anything remotely similar to us. I’m not saying we started a revolution or anything but we were kind of “least likely to succeed”. Our belief in what we do though shines through and that is something that people grasp on to. If you can’t believe in yourself, why should anyone else? We are also very approachable. We have been doing this a long time so don’t have massive egos, we genuinely appreciate anyone that has taken the time to at least give us a chance. Of course, if they don’t like what we do, fuck them (but thanks for trying!).
When do you envisage the new album will be released?
I really hope it will be out in the UK November 2010 (in time to cash in for Christmas!) and then other territories started early 2011. All that is to be confirmed though, so don’t hold me to it!
Where can fans get updates about the recording of the new album?
I am working on a dedicated “Making Of” website that will be blog based full of exclusive behind-the-scenes stuff. Movies, MP3’s, written blogs, outtakes and anything else I can think of. The website is the name of the album, which I’m not revealing yet but, if people hook up with us on Facebook or Twitter (links from the main www), all will be revealed as soon as possible!
Finally, as we ask all our interviewees, what is the meaning of life??
Um, I hate to end this all on a bit of a downer, but I don’t actually think there is a meaning to life. We are all pretty pointless and insignificant in the big scheme of things. The grain of sand on a beach syndrome. Shame we are filled with egos that make us think we are all that AND a bag of chips. So, with that in mind, the unwavering fact that in 100 years we’ll all be piles of dust, I’d just encourage anyone and everyone to follow their hearts and follow their dreams, whatever they may be because, ultimately, none of this matters. Enjoy!
Thanks Zion – you are a true star, thanks for your time!!!
And thank you, Shane, for giving me this opportunity
ShaneRockpit
May 2010